Cult avant-garde neo-classical rock duo These New Puritans (twin brothers Jack and George Barnett) are back with two new singles, “Industrial Love Song” with Caroline Polachek and “Bells”, with new album Crooked Wing set for release on May 23. We listened to the record and then talked to Jack on Zoom for an occasionally philosophical chat.
Jack Barnett: (referring to my Xiu Xiu shirt) I like your T-shirt.
Thanks. I really love Xiu Xiu.
I used to love them when I was a teenager. I listened to them a lot. I think in that particular era, there were some really great bands around that didn’t really fit into any category. They were just doing their own thing.
I think you’re also one of those bands that just do their own thing.
Thanks. I met Jaime (Stewart) once at a festival in… Well, I don’t remember where. That was a long time ago. He seemed like a nice bloke.
It’s been six years since you made a full length studio record, but it certainly seems like it was much longer ago, there is so many crazy stuff that’s been going on, like the pandemic, wars, genocide, and the tech oligarchy age we are stepping onto. Considering the fast-paced world revolving around us, when you went into the studio to record Crooked Wing, did you and George feel like you were people born anew?
Well, I feel like that for every album. Every time it feels like the first album you’ve ever made, and also the last album you’ve ever made. You’ve got to learn how to make music again and you’ve also got to forget everything as well. But it’s even more so this time. When I hear the words “six years”, I almost feel ashamed, or scared, or embarrassed. It’s been a long time. But sometimes you just have to follow as much as you can. You have to follow the song, follow the music. Sometimes you think you finished it, then a song will start to transform into something else, and you’ve got to follow it. Sometimes, maybe that’s why it takes longer.
The recording process started with a field recording for you. Can we hear that initial sound on the record, or has it completely changed into something else?
No, you can hear it. It’s all over the album. It’s most obvious in the song “Bells”, but it’s elsewhere as well. It’s used in transformed ways as well. Sometimes you need something like a signpost or a little guide to tell you where to go. My way to write music is that I write lots of different things. Lots and lots of music, and there’s nothing holding it together. It’s all going in different directions, all vying for your attention. It’s chaos, and then you’ve got to sort through it and see where you want to go. It was like that for the sound that opened up this song called “Bells”. And then that song was like, “Ah, this is the way to go.”
Maybe it’s all about organizing chaos. In our lives too, even.
That’s exactly it, I think. Yeah, you’re right.
I was very pleasantly surprised when I found out that “Industrial Love Song” was a duet with Caroline Polachek, one of my favorite contemporary artists. Can you tell me more on how that collaboration developed?
Well, she got in contact with us just saying that she loved our last album, Inside the Rose. A little while later, I think George just sent her this song that became “Industrial Love Song”. At that point, it wasn’t “Industrial Love Song”. It was just the melody and the chords. It was funny because the demo that we’d made had this strange half natural, half unnatural voice. It had almost the quality of an opera singer or something, but also a not robotic, but digitized voice. Then Caroline came along and suddenly that sound made sense. It was the soil the song was looking for. It was searching for something all along, and we found it when Caroline’s voice and Caroline herself came along.
I mean, she has an amazing voice and she can use her voice in amazing ways. She’s amazing here too.
Yeah. When I listened to her music there were things that I thought must be some kind of effect or treatment, but she can do them with her voice, you know, she can do it in real time. I like that kind of dichotomy. Something about that appeals to me. I think it worked out well. We just recorded for a day together and yeah, I think it came alive.
The song has an interesting theme exploring the humanity of the machines. The sentiment, I think, resonates greatly to today’s world where a new medium called AI is entering our lives in a profound way, and doing so during the rise of fascist regimes centered around tech oligarchy. Amidst all these conditions, how hopeful are you in terms of preseversing humanity?
I think it is terrifying and we have to resist it and keep what’s precious about being human. We have to try and preserve it. But it’s funny, this song. I think it was written, I don’t know, maybe four years ago or something. So it was before all the AI stuff was really happening. Subsequently, obviously, it seems like it has this added resonance, as if we feel like we are becoming almost obsolete along with our machines. Suddenly we have a kind of unity with them. So it didn’t seem absurd to write a love song between two machines.
Who other collaborators do we hear on the album?
I think a few stories I’ve seen in the press have really run away with that. There’s not that many people. 90% of it is just me and George. There is also Chris Laurence, who’s a brilliant British jazz double bassist and is just a kind of musician that doesn’t really exist anymore. He came up at an interesting time. He’s played on Elton John and Peter Gabriel records, but at the same time, he plays on Kenny Wheeler and Gil Evans, some very deep, rich jazz or experimental music and classical music. He’s a kind of musician who can inhabit these completely different worlds in an authentic way, and I think it’s a very rare thing now. He came in for one day and just played. It’s still an inspiration to see someone like that at the top of their game, and to just witness the amazing focus and intensity he has brought to the double bass parts. Also this is the first album where we’ve got the two original members, Sophie and Tom, to play as well.
If you were to pick two songs from the album, one easiest and one hardest to create, which two would you choose, do you think?
The hard one would probably be “Bells”. Actually, I don’t know whether it was hard, but it had a strange history. It was originally the middle section of a completely separate song. It kind of grew into this longer thing. It was Graham Sutton, the producer, who said, “This is its own song.” It just grew into something completely different. That took a long time. But I don’t know, it probably wasn’t difficult. It’s just-
Just took a long time?
Yeah. The easy one is maybe “Crooked Wing”, that just came together in almost a kind of trance where everything flows. One second it’s not there, and the next second it is, fully formed.
Speaking of trance, how active is your dream life? Do you think it ever influences your songwriting?
I have a very, very active dream life. And I think making music feels best when it feels like you’re dreaming or when those two states are very close. So the ideal situation is to be dreaming, actually. I’ve dreamt music as well. I dream music quite often. There’s a song on Inside the Rose called “Where the Trees Are on Fire”. In that song, I dreamt I was walking along with a friend of mine. We looked over to the horizon and then across the river, there were some trees that were on fire. My friend said, “Look over there, the trees are on fire!” and then the song started up, like in a musical. I was just listening to it and woke up and sang it. But sometimes my dream music is really bad, you know, like some kind of reggae pastiche or some bad nu metal kind of thing. Every now and then, there’ll be a good one.
That makes me think of a possible metal album by you.
Wow. Never say never.
If you have access to it right now, can you tell me the last three songs you played on your streaming platform?
(checks) Okay, wait a sec. Some of this I haven’t played, so I’m a bit confused. Okay. Yes, there is “The Sensual World” by Kate Bush. I think that was when I was actually in the gym. I’ve got to that age where I go to the gym and listen to Kate Bush. (laughs)
I also listened to “The Rite of Spring”. Then there’s a song called “Eileen Aroon” by The Clancy Brothers, which is an Irish traditional thing. I don’t love everything about the recording, but I think it’s a great song. Maybe I’ll do a cover of it one day. I also listened to “Gotta Serve Somebody” by Bob Dylan.
I’m gonna divert from the topic, but have you seen Bob Dylan’s Instagram account posting Machine Gun Kelly?
Yeah, it’s phenomenal, isn’t it? I think it’s great. There’s this strange, half-hour video about Andrew Jackson, the president.
Yeah, he is a phenomenal Instagram user.
Yeah. You can’t predict what he’s gonna do, can you?
Let’s imagine we’re at a Musicians Theme Park 100 years from now, where every artist or band featured has their own memorial stone with a certain lyric by them written on it. Which one of the lyrics would you like to see written on These New Puritans’ stone?
Well, that’s not an easy thing to answer, is it?
Yeah. You can take your time.
I have a funny relationship with meaning, or lyrics, even. To me, the sound always comes first, and then gradually words and meanings attach themselves. I don’t know if any of the songs even mean anything whatsoever. I’m racking my brains. I have enough trouble just remembering the lyrics when we play live.
Saying pass is always an option (laughs).
No, no, I’m trying to think it through. Oh, maybe “This is where your dreams come true. Your nightmares, too” from “Where the Trees are On Fire”. That’ll do.
Cool pick.
Well, you know, we talked about dreams, so that came to mind.
That’s all of my questions Jacx. It was nice to meet you.
Thank you so much for your time. I really appreciate it. I only just really thought about your background there. That’s quite impressive. Disappearing into the forest… It’s nice. Don’t get lost, though.
Maybe I want to get lost. (both laugh)
Fair enough.
You can check out These New Puritans’ Bandcamp profile here.
